Contra Fouls

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oldtimer
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Contra Fouls

Postby oldtimer » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:41 pm

In reading various threads here, I came across one that opined about the increased frequency of contra fouls being called on the perimeter, and it suggested this is the reason the driving game has been lost.

This raises several questions in my mind:

1) Is the 'problem' that these fouls are being called away from the ball?
2) Are the fouls the result of gross-and-go, or pushing off due to an attempted V-out... or perhaps something else?
3) Are they the result of a change in how the game is called, or in how coaches are teaching their players?

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Allen Lorentzen
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Re: Contra Fouls

Postby Allen Lorentzen » Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:04 pm

I don't recall discussion about increased contra fouls on the perimeter. I could be wrong. I do recall discussion about more contras being called at set - away from the ball. It has been discussed that the perimeter players may be afraid to drive past their defenders because this would put them behind going the other way if a contra is called at set at just that time.

oldtimer
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Re: Contra Fouls

Postby oldtimer » Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:37 pm

I may have mis-remembered the thread, as I have been reading through many of these.

That being the case - the last question I have still remains: Is this a result of a change in how the calls are made, or the result of 'bad coaching' of the center players?

I have been playing with someone who get separation from the defender by first pushing back hard with his body (keeping his head tucked so it isn't a 'head butt') then stepping out to make the shot. It seems this is how he was coached to get separation - but I don't recall anyone using that move in set when I played (I played center defender most of the time). Of course, I was also taught to defend with both hands up over the center to avoid fouls and to deflect any passes that came in too close, so perhaps that move would have been much more difficult (my legs aren't what they once were!). My first impression was that this should be an offensive foul - but perhaps it is not (or maybe it was not for awhile, but is now).

So is this a difference in rules/refereeing, or just coaches/players trying to get away with whatever they can?

EDIT: Sorry, I know I went off on a tangent since we were discussing fouls away from the ball - but this particular situation came to mind. However, the question still remains whether wrestling at center position was tolerated previously, but is not so now - or are the centers being taught incorrectly how to get position?

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Re: Contra Fouls

Postby Doru Roll » Sat Apr 21, 2012 8:15 am

oldtimer, everything is being blamed for the loss of the game. It's a highly debated issue. This forum is replete with lively discussions on that topic.

The move you describe was pioneered by a Russian player called Mshevenieradze back in the 60's. He would move the defender back several meters before stepping out for the shot. It only works if the hole guard plays high out of the water, hands up in a hips down, vertical position, like we were taught to do back during the 3 fouls at set days. It doesn't work if the defender is horizontal and checking the set with his chest.

The reason a contra at center is not often whistled is to promote offense. Tha's the intent of WP7.3. It would be illogical to whistle a minor contra at set as the attacker is working for position, before an entry pass. However, if (s)he pushes off the defender after the pass enters, then a contra is appropriate. If you read through Russ's posts you'll find explanations to both your questions.

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